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Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

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Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby sidelined » Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:05 pm

I thought it might be useful to have a thread for discussion of the champs as a whole.

There was lots of drama and lots of great performances, but it was a pity the stands seemed to be mostly empty for a lot of the sessions, especially the mornings. Maybe it felt different in the stadium (flumpy and mump boy can tell us). I know the IAAF wants to build a truly global audience for athletics but is it the right decision to give the champs to a country that doesn't seem to have much enthusiasm for the sport?

Seven medals for GB is a good haul: any more and it would have felt impossible to repeat next year. It's good that the four big hopes all got on the podium (I'm not going to complain about the silvers). It's good that a new generation of athletes got themselves there when they weren't expecting to go (Clarke, Green, Woodward, Shane, Osagie, Bleasdale, Hitchon, Jackson, Morse). The cruellest blow for me was Tomlinson getting injured when he'd been in his best ever form and had such a consistent season. The most irritating was PSD not making the final when she could have done.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby 1981aLaN » Sun Sep 04, 2011 5:37 pm

GB did well with their 7 medals - do we know of any other country who use a "medal target" like CVC? Yes there was a few disappointments that have been widely discussed elsewhere but they'll learn and do what it takes to put it right for next year and those who've surpassed themselves I hope will build for the biggest event of their lives in a years time.

With the best time since 1992 Sally Pearson was the athlete of the games for me - I never thought i'd see an athlete get under 12.3 for 100mH and only 0.07 off the world record there is already much talk of that run being the "world record" in a similar vein to the chinese 1500/3000/10000 records.

Allyson Felix with 4 medals (2G, 1S, 1B) was pretty impressive, Bolt bouncing back in the 200 and relay, 3 throws over 70m in womens javelin, Kim Collins in the 100 & St Kitts relay team, James in the 400 - all worthy of a mention.

The overall scheduling has hindered my enjoyment massively of this edition of the WC's and I hope its put back before next year, in particular:

1. The "qualification" 100m round - did that really achieve something?
2. The 3 semi setup for 100/200 - havent really liked any event less than 400m having this setup, save it for the indoor champs. Use a two heat top 4 or 3+2 setup.
3. The decision to move the 4x4 from the final day, surely this is the "traditional" last event of a championships.
4. Day 5 featured only the womens 20km walk - whats the logic behind that?
5. Shot put finals tend to be on the same day of the qualification round and has been like this for years, so why be different?

I immensely enjoyed Berlin 2009 and part of that was down to the fact that Germany has a rich tradition in track and field and turned out extensively to support their athletes, one thing I think that was missing from Daegu 2011.
Last edited by 1981aLaN on Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby LiamRiley » Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:07 pm

I actually thought the break day was a good idea, from an audience perspective. I love athletics, but it was nice to be able to have one day out of the nine where I had the chance to do something else!
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby nevetssllim » Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:16 pm

LiamRiley wrote:I actually thought the break day was a good idea, from an audience perspective. I love athletics, but it was nice to be able to have one day out of the nine where I had the chance to do something else!


I agree - namely catch up on sleep! I was a bit dubious about the scheduling but it played out very well with an epic 800m final and a world record in the 4x100m and the fact it's essentially an eight-day meeting means you have more concentrated evening sessions when they can be a little bit thin on the ground. One thing which I did find a bit annoying was the field event finals always seemed to be clustered together at the start of the programme which made it nye on impossible for the producers to show the viewers live coverage when there were sometimes three events happening at the same time. Really don't like the three semi-final format. What's wrong with two semi-finals of eight athletes with the first four making the final? It makes the heats more competitive (good for viewers) and it makes the semi-finals fair (good for the athletes).

Initially I was a little bit disappointed with some of the British performances although they don't seem to be as bad in hindsight. I was annoyed Jenny Meadows didn't make the 800m final but all of the athletes in the final have quicker PBs (and only one has a slower season's best) so she didn't necessarily underperform and perhaps some of us had too high expectations for the likes of Bleasdale. I didn't expect her to get among the medals but I thought she was a safe bet for a top-three finish. I thought Sayers was very disappointing though, as were our high jumpers.
Last edited by nevetssllim on Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby trickstat » Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:09 pm

I think the 3 semi format has become rampant as a result of the IAAF setting standards that result in there being more than 4 first round heats (which would mean 2 semis) but not enough athletes for 4 rounds in total. To prevent it being so prevalent will require either an easing of some standards or a change in the IAAF's seeding rules. For instance, if you have 5 heats that would probably mean first 2 plus 6 fastest losers which is rather draconian (not that first 2 plus 2 isn't either!).

Regarding standards I think that the men's 400m was actually weakened by moving the A standard up from 45.55 to 45.25. This thinned the field out to the extent that a time outside 46 seconds made the semi-final.

I think the reason the women's 20Km Walk was the only event on Day 5 is that it is the event where there is the smallest chance (virtually nil) of an athlete doing another event.

Unless the shot-putters really like doing two comps in a day I don't see any reason why they should have to.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby Kermit » Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:41 pm

The changes made to the rounds and the qualification of those rounds were made for TV purposes and WILL be in place next year. We had a discussion on the main board months ago about it when we found out out the first round bye given to the top athletes in the 100m.

It also appears that CVC is spitting feathers at a few athletes

The 4x4 was appalling, no real effort, unforgiveable really, and of course we expected an athlete in the 800m final for women


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/athletics/14780786.stm
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby iain » Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:48 pm

What was going on with the Spain women 4x100m?! Ruth Beitia on anchor?! It's no wonder they ran outside of 46
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby trickstat » Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:53 pm

Kermit wrote:The changes made to the rounds and the qualification of those rounds were made for TV purposes and WILL be in place next year. We had a discussion on the main board months ago about it when we found out out the first round bye given to the top athletes in the 100m.


Doesn't stop them being crap though IMHO.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby Kermit » Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:03 am

True trickstat but unfortunately the IAAF need the money and they also need the sport to get recognised, therefore they have to dance to the tune of the TV moguls.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby trickstat » Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:08 am

From a British point of view turning 12 top 8 places into 7 medals was quite something!

Disappointing that none of Chambers, Malcolm, Rooney, Rimmer, Bernard, Parsons, Lewis, Tomlinson, Rutherford, Kwakye, Ohurougu, Meadows, Okoro, Dobriskey, Shakes-Drayton and Dennison made the top 8. All of these have been top 8 in a worldwide champs and/or Euro medallists since 2008. I admit some of these had better excuses than others and some would have been surprising top 8 placers but that is quite a long list.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby Uri » Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:23 am

1981aLaN wrote:With the best time since 1992 Sally Pearson was the athlete of the games for me - I never thought i'd see an athlete get under 12.3 for 100mH and only 0.07 off the world record there is already much talk of that run being the "world record" in a similar vein to the chinese 1500/3000/10000 records.


The same can be said about Valerie Adams' 21.24 - the best throw since the '80 (apart from Pavlysh's 21.69 in 1998, a year before she was banned).
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby Ursus » Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:01 pm

All of our realistic hopes did well. Might have hoped for a couple more golds, but Philips and Jess were beaten by performances beyond their lifetime bests. Silver is not however to be sniffed at.

Another plus is that all the medallists were individual. Too often, the medal count has been inflated in the past with "cheap" relay medals.

Morse, Bleasdale and Hitchon turned in varying performances but will be much the better for the experience. If they're good enough, they're old enough - get them to the globals to give them experience - Daley Thompson was 18 and 18th in his first Olympics....On the flip side, what was the point in Malcolm & Devonish being in individual events?

Biggest disappointments:

Sayers. And the lack of Brits (bar England) turning in performances that made you think "Wow, I didn't see that coming"; at least not in a good way. Most of our sprinters.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby chaz_78 » Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:00 pm

I think Shara Proctor was also disappointing. A poor standrard competition all round but she's jumped 6.80 this season (good enough for silver) and she failed to qualify for the final with a best of 6.34, less than Jess jumped in the Heptathlon :?

Shame to see Lisa go out in the first round, also very disappointing when you see the final result. I guess the constant struggles with injury were going to catch up with her one day, it wasn't always going to come right every time at the champs.

As much as I admire the likes of Vivian Cheruiyot I miss the days when Radcliffe, Szabo, O'Sullivan, Ribeiro etc were able to challenge the Africans in the womens distance races

Great from all the medallists though and could have been another gold too if Jess had got her Javelin right
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby sovietvest » Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:43 pm

trickstat wrote:From a British point of view turning 12 top 8 places into 7 medals was quite something!

Disappointing that none of Chambers, Malcolm, Rooney, Rimmer, Bernard, Parsons, Lewis, Tomlinson, Rutherford, Kwakye, Ohurougu, Meadows, Okoro, Dobriskey, Shakes-Drayton and Dennison made the top 8. All of these have been top 8 in a worldwide champs and/or Euro medallists since 2008. I admit some of these had better excuses than others and some would have been surprising top 8 placers but that is quite a long list.


I think we need to view all of the above athletes after next year, but dropping from 20 top 8 finishes in Berlin to just 12 is very disappointing. I've always felt that is a better measure of a team than medals won. CVC measure others by results with no excuses accepted - on that basis I trust he won't be getting a performance-related bonus this year!
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby trickstat » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:04 pm

trickstat wrote:From a British point of view turning 12 top 8 places into 7 medals was quite something!

Disappointing that none of Chambers, Malcolm, Rooney, Rimmer, Bernard, Parsons, Lewis, Tomlinson, Rutherford, Kwakye, Ohurougu, Meadows, Okoro, Dobriskey, Shakes-Drayton and Dennison made the top 8. All of these have been top 8 in a worldwide champs and/or Euro medallists since 2008. I admit some of these had better excuses than others and some would have been surprising top 8 placers but that is quite a long list.


Add Goldie Sayers - 4th in Beijing 2008 and a more likely top 8 placer on paper than many of the above.
Add Shara Proctor - 6th in Berlin 2009 for Anguilla.
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby devonian » Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:13 pm

I've got Post Championships Withdrawal Symptoms today, there's an empty space where live championship athletics should be :(

I've had to start watching the champs from scratch again to keep me sane
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby usedtoit33 » Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:04 pm

I'm sort of relieved. My sleeping pattern's taking a while to adjust after staying up to watch the morning sessions and only having a two or three hour nap inbetween those and the evening sessions. :lol:
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby GBSupporter » Tue Sep 06, 2011 5:00 pm

In answer to sidelines question " is it right to give the games to a country that seems to show less enthusiasm "
I think theres a whole lot of factors to consider . You said it yourself about reaching a global audience is key .Therefore time differences and accessability count . If it was restricted to major players we'd have the same countries every time . Plus theres the cost . Sadly the Africans can't hold a games yet . Try to pick a country other than Europe or North America ,it quite difficult . Brazil .Japan and China are the only ones | can come up with . I cant see a carribbean country able either .
The rescheduling of the programme I thought was for the home audience . It worked .40,000 for the last day I understand and they went nuts over Bolt . Not my reason for watching athletics but I'm happy to go with the flow providing I get to see all the action .
I liked the 3 semis. Those that jogged around did so at their peril . That worked as we saw in the middle distance races post a fast time or else .
From a GB point of view very mixed I thought . The 4 medal hopes all delivered ,any of whom could have produced gold .
Thanks to Mo we got a bonus making 5 .The other 2 ,well lets just say I doubt if that can be repeated next year .
So any realistic suggestions who the other 3 definate medals will come from discounting relays .
I dont think you can ever write off Paula . We will have a good indicator at the Berlin marathon .
And I'm hoping Steph Twell will shine in the 5000m..big ask probably.
Like many I think I was disappointed again with a number of decentish athletes struggle due to injury unable to build on past very good performances .
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby mump boy » Tue Sep 06, 2011 5:55 pm

Uri wrote:
1981aLaN wrote:With the best time since 1992 Sally Pearson was the athlete of the games for me - I never thought i'd see an athlete get under 12.3 for 100mH and only 0.07 off the world record there is already much talk of that run being the "world record" in a similar vein to the chinese 1500/3000/10000 records.


The same can be said about Valerie Adams' 21.24 - the best throw since the '80 (apart from Pavlysh's 21.69 in 1998, a year before she was banned).


Druggie Peleshenko also threw further in 2000

I didn't realise Valerie's throw was so far, further than Asrid Kumbernuss ever threw :shock:
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Re: Daegu in review: conclusions and random thoughts

Postby mump boy » Tue Sep 06, 2011 5:58 pm

[quote="sidelined"]I thought it might be useful to have a thread for discussion of the champs as a whole.

There was lots of drama and lots of great performances, but it was a pity the stands seemed to be mostly empty for a lot of the sessions, especially the mornings. Maybe it felt different in the stadium (flumpy and mump boy can tell us). I know the IAAF wants to build a truly global audience for athletics but is it the right decision to give the champs to a country that doesn't seem to have much enthusiasm for the sport?
quote]

I didn't feel like the stadium ever felt very empty in fact most days it was overflowing. They bussed loads of kids in for morning sessions and after the first few days when they'd sorted out the transport out the evening sessions felt pretty full too.
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