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Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

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Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:45 pm

Had a look around the Stadium today and noticed that one important item is missing - the 'wrap' or 'curtain' that was supposed to go around the stadium and shelter the spectators and most importantly the athletes from the wind. Instead we have some nice streamers but nothing that will fix the problems seen during the test event. If you look at the picture below you can see the wrap in item 2. I was told some time ago that this was needed for keeping the wind out but was proving so expensive (something like £5-7mil) it was 'cut' to save on budget.

Image

The problem for me is that the stadium is pretty breezy with wind swirling within it. This could severely hamper times in the 400m and distance events. It could either help or hinder the short sprints and will mean the difference between winning and losing for right vs left handed discus throwers depending on it's direction during that event.

After such fabulous performances in Beijing, this could really suppress performances and lead to a 'flat' olympics if races are won in slow times. I'm surprised this has not been picked up by a newspaper yet... or maybe they are saving it for next week?
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby djhdjh » Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:39 am

Was it really that windy? I competed at the Disability Test Event and although there was a fair amount of wind around on the day at the warm up track I didn't notice anything much once I got into the main stadium. Looking at the results from BUCS apart from 1 race at +2.0 it didn't look particularly vicious there either, though I appreciate wind gauges don't necessarily tell the whole story. Stadiums that size tend to block the wind a lot on their own anyway.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:21 am

Typically top level competitions like Berlin Beijing etc have ZERO wind and that helps with the performances. London will be compared to these events and even a -1m/s in the 100m will spoil the show. Imagine if the 100m final is run into a -2m/s... how many people will be able to run under 10s?
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby djhdjh » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:03 am

It won't spoil the show for me. I'm more interested in medals than times at major championships and I imagine most athletes will be the same.

Also, I'm not sure other places are quite as brilliant at stopping the wind as you're making out. The last two World Championship Men's 100m finals were run with a +0.9 and -1.4 respectively - just using the most high profile example since your worry is about the image of the games. Going by the test event results something below 1 in either direction is most likely and anything over 1.3 either way is very unlikely.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby ultragirl » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:22 am

As long as it doesn't rain I am not that bothered about the effect the wind may have.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby djlovesyou » Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:16 pm

I too don't like this idea that a guy not running extra-terrestrial times in the 100m somehow 'spoils the show'.

I take you haven't really enjoyed a women's 400 since Marita Koch?
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby Rapunzel1975 » Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:31 pm

djlovesyou wrote:I too don't like this idea that a guy not running extra-terrestrial times in the 100m somehow 'spoils the show'.

Agreed.
Although the good times added to the excitment, for me the thrill was when Usain Bolt won his titles by such a big margin and with what appeared to consumate ease.
Other races over longer distances have been thrilling because of the head-to-head competition. It would be nice to have fantastic times, but it wouldn't be the end of the world if we didn't.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby Damocles » Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:50 pm

The wrap was due to be paid for by Dow Chemicals, indeed it may well have been made.

However Dow Chemicals bought up a company called Union Carbide, which was involved in a major chemical leak in Bhopal some 30 + years ago.

Dow withdrew their offer of the wrap, due to protests about Union Carbide, with whom they had no links all those years ago. Imagine, if someone had been killed 50 years ago, in your house you bought 10 years ago, would you give credence to someone blaming you for the death?

So, if you see a problem with no wrap, blame the protest groups, who should have just been told to wrap up.

Still, the throwers might like to have a wind in a major stadium for once.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Thu Jul 26, 2012 5:14 pm

Your point about the throws was actually something I was considering. It would be great if the games were won with a 70m+ throw in the discus for a change.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby sovietvest » Thu Jul 26, 2012 5:33 pm

Helsinki '83 is generally remembered as a great champs and that was very windy with some slow sprint times. Personally, if we see the big 5 all fit and ready to race in the M100m, I don't care what time is run. A 10.0 into a 3m/s wind would be just as exciting for me.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby trickstat » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:11 pm

It seems to me that the wrap was always mainly a cosmetic/commercial thing rather than a practical consideration. I do think the shelter element may have been more to do with shelter for spectators just outside the stadium itself rather than to keep out wind and it wouldn't have kept out wind blowing over the top of the stands. My own experience of the stadium is that it keeps out wind very well considering it is in a fairly exposed position quite near tidal water. The track being below ground level probably helps a bit.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby AllanW » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:34 pm

Damocles wrote:Dow withdrew their offer of the wrap, due to protests about Union Carbide, with whom they had no links all those years ago. Imagine, if someone had been killed 50 years ago, in your house you bought 10 years ago, would you give credence to someone blaming you for the death?

So, if you see a problem with no wrap, blame the protest groups, who should have just been told to wrap up.


*bites tongue repeatedly at sheer inanity of these sentences and the ignorance they display but realises that it would derail the thread to correct it all*
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby SteveK26 » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:27 am

Allan
Its my understanding that the wrap was going to be a canvas (going all the way around ) that was to be used as a digital display. They were going to project live results etc on it that could be seen for miles if you had a good vantage point.
They abandoned the idea on the basis of cost when the city was plunged into financial meltdown.

I could be wrong, but I think thats why it never got included. Had the origional plan gone ahead, it would have been spectacular and unique.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby Damocles » Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:59 pm

*bites tongue repeatedly at sheer inanity of these sentences and the ignorance they display but realises that it would derail the thread to correct it all*

One should bite ones tongue, when the tongue has nothing to say........

Have you considered politics?
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby LiamRiley » Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:39 am

AllanW wrote:
Damocles wrote:Dow withdrew their offer of the wrap, due to protests about Union Carbide, with whom they had no links all those years ago. Imagine, if someone had been killed 50 years ago, in your house you bought 10 years ago, would you give credence to someone blaming you for the death?

So, if you see a problem with no wrap, blame the protest groups, who should have just been told to wrap up.


*bites tongue repeatedly at sheer inanity of these sentences and the ignorance they display but realises that it would derail the thread to correct it all*

Makes two of us!
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby trickstat » Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:46 am

AllanW wrote:
Damocles wrote:Dow withdrew their offer of the wrap, due to protests about Union Carbide, with whom they had no links all those years ago. Imagine, if someone had been killed 50 years ago, in your house you bought 10 years ago, would you give credence to someone blaming you for the death?

So, if you see a problem with no wrap, blame the protest groups, who should have just been told to wrap up.


*bites tongue repeatedly at sheer inanity of these sentences and the ignorance they display but realises that it would derail the thread to correct it all*


Thirded! :roll:
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby iain » Sun Jul 29, 2012 1:21 pm

On the radio yesterday it said that there was a wrap to stop the wind.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby moshimoshi » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:06 am

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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:30 am

As I described badly the wrap is not 'solid' and doesn't do anything for the wind. This photo shows it well...

Image
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby Doofus » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:55 am

A few months I watched a very interesting programme about the design and build of the Olympic Stadium.
It was designed specifically to keep the winds to a minimum. The designers were well aware of the location and probability of strong winds and so the angle of the roof, the depth of the bowl and the whole design was based around the winds not being over the limits. They didn't want to threaten any chances of world records being achieved at our Olympics.
The wrap, from what I gather, was purely to make it look spectacular but was not necessary.
If I remember correctly the test event at the BUCS champs was quite a windy weekend but this didn't show inside the stadium.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby jeremy1 » Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:18 pm

The original wrap was going to be entirely different in design ... a full wrap with fancy lighting and logos on which was cancelled by LOCOG under pressure by the Government to save money; the wrap now carried out by Dow is the cheaper replacement which was first shown on the London2012 official site ages ago.How effective , I do not know probably not much.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby Geoff » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:54 pm

I too saw the programme on the design and construction of the OS, last week so must have been a repeat, and the original wrap was meant to be digital and able to dispaly live pictures and results. It was cut for financial reasons. The wrap is purely aesthetic as the seats are not open so will not allow wind to blow through. The roof is designed, in theory, for wind to blow over the stadium but I have my doubts.

The forecast for Friday is for strong soth/south westerly winds mean a headwind for the heptahletes in the hurdles. Any southerly or westerly winds will have an effect on the sprints including 200 and 400 as there could be strong headwinds on the top bend. I'm not sure the track has been orientated in the best direction. A northerly wind will, obviously, be behind the sprinters but that could mean cooler conditions.

We will see on Friday whether the track is well sheltered.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby jeremy1 » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:13 pm

We have a great tradition of headwinds in stadia in this country.

Coe famously said that the wind would not be a problem cos its metres below the natural ground level. Well we will soon see.

I reckon the athletics in the Stadium in the rather cool evening conditons will not be a feast of records, but great competitions; we had our summer last week.!
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:53 am

All I can say from my experience is that if you are coming to London make sure you bring some waterproofs and gloves just in case!
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby kingmaker » Thu Aug 02, 2012 8:07 am

its a little windy down there, in a empty stadium, really cant see it being that much of a issue with 80,000 bodies in there. Just hope the corporate freebie holders turn up or someone else fills the gaps
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby devonian » Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:25 am

I was lucky enough to be close to the front row at the opening ceremony and it was pretty gusty at times, surprisingly so.
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:51 am

That was my experience also! We will see what happens tomorrow ;-)
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Re: Will the wind spoil the Olympics as 'Wrap' is forgotten!

Postby TheRealSub10 » Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:10 am

Well the wind is all over the place here in the stadium as I suspected -1.6s and +2.0s within an hour of each other!
Thankfully didn't stop JENNIS blasting out a hurdles time though!
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