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SPOTY 2017

This topic contains 57 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of ursus Ursus 3 weeks, 2 days ago.

Viewing 25 posts - 26 through 50 (of 58 total)
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  • #68462
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    I’ve nothing at all against Murray. He is a great sportsman and has done wonders for British tennis.

    But in terms of sporting excellence Adam Peaty and Mo Farah are both his equals at the very least.
    And have been for years.

    #68464
    Profile photo of laps
    Laps
    Participant

    I’ve nothing at all against Murray. He is a great sportsman and has done wonders for British tennis.
    But in terms of sporting excellence Adam Peaty and Mo Farah are both his equals at the very least.
    And have been for years.

    Well Steve it is all a matter of opinion. To some extent SPOTY is about the status and popularity of the sport, the popularity of the individual, the uniqueness of the achievement, timing, momentum behind the vote. Some achievements are iconic in sport – Wimbledon Champion, World Heavyweight Champion, World F1 Champion, 100m Champion, World Cup, Ashes, Tour De France…… Win one of those and it’s special. Murray just happened to win Wimbledon, the first Bit for 77 years (2013), then the Davis Cup (2015), then Wimbledon + Olympic Gold + No.1 Ranking with excellent timing (2016). Nobody’s likely to do that sort of thing again. Peaty is out on his own with world records to prove it, but he’s in a sport which has a modest TV profile and where the best win multiple gold medals. Mo has great public support and has shown his dominance in two events over and over again. Normally just repeating what you’ve done before does not cut it but this time he is the emotional choice. Froome is going for a unique achievement in British sport, rarely achieved internationally. Joshua is World Heavyweight Champion. It’s a hard pick.

    #68465
    Profile photo of treadwater1
    treadwater1
    Participant

    I just spent 10 minutes writing out a post only for it to be deleted on pressing submit, this forum drives you mad at times. Another attempt in a moment…

    #68466
    Profile photo of treadwater1
    treadwater1
    Participant

    Murrays win in 2015 was undeserved IMO, he hadn’t done much in the majors that year and won it solely because of his performances in the Davis Cup, don’t get me wrong it was a fine achievement but the competition lacks validity if one world class player can be entered in 3 rubbers and therefore has the possibility to win it single handed. His other 2 wins were thoroughly deserved

    I’d love to see Federer win the overseas SPOTY this year, even if he doesn’t win the US he deserves it (at 36) for the Aus and Wimbledon victories

    I’m struggling to see how Defoe’s in there at this stage, he wasn’t even amongst the 10 best players in the premiership last season, he was very generous with his time with Bradley Lowery but I can’t see how that makes him a better sportsman than a host of others

    #68467
    Profile photo of geoff
    geoff
    Participant

    As Laps says it is more than the performance but many other factors affecting the result. This year Mo has one additional factor to go with his medals that he hasn’t had before. He’s retiring from the track. This is his best chance ever to win SPOTY and should do very well but doping in our sport and accusations still hanging over Salazar may scupper his chances. And there’s a chance USAD could charge Salazar this autumn which would certainly mean Mo would not win.

    I hope he wins though!

    #68471
    Profile photo of mrme
    MrMe
    Participant

    Am I the only one here not getting the relevance of the Davis cup?

    In terms of sporting achievements I wouldn’t rank it anywhere near a Tour de France win, a Wimbledon win, winning gold in an olympic track event, winning the world cup etc.

    Don’t think 2015 was a defining moment for Murray at all compared to his other two SPOTY wins.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 3 weeks ago by Profile photo of mrme mrme.
    #68476
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    MrMe

    It has no great relevance other than it sticks in the mind as an historic victory for GB. Hence votes flood in for spoty.
    Correct me if I’m wrong, (and I’m sure some will be queueing up to do so), but I don’t recall Murray having to beat any of the world’s top half dozen on route to victory. And with his brother Jamie being one of the best doubles players in the world the format of best of five rubbers (reverse singles and one doubles) was always likely to result in a GB win. Especially in front of partisan crowds.

    His Wimbledon victories and Olympic success are on a different level to the Davis Cup win.

    #68477
    Profile photo of taffy
    Taffy
    Participant

    no Mr ME, I also get the relevance, as do the many people I know and work with who like most sports ( including athletics). They are not just armchair fans they participate and attend events.

    So who should have won in 2015? Mo? He was up against other athletes who diluted his support. There is also a lot of uneasiness over the Salazar link among sports fans.

    Do I think Mo deserved to win SPOTY in 2015. Yes. However, I can see why many people voted for Murray.

    I just hope Hamilton doesn’t win this year. I suspect it will be Joshua, but feel Froome deserves it. I would be elated it either Mo or Peaty won it.

    #68478
    Profile photo of taffy
    Taffy
    Participant

    Steve he beat several high ranked payers including Tsonga. Plus the final was on clay where he beat two clay court specialists.

    As for his brother being a superb doubles player, Andy isn’t a double specialist. They beat teams who had double specialists. It is a best of 5 match, how many rubbers did the second ranked British singles guy win.

    So Steve , who should have won in 2015 ?

    #68479
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    Farah, Peaty, or Jess Ennis-Hill would all have been worthy winners in 2015.

    I’ll throw a question right back to you, Taffy.
    If tennis wasn’t the BBC’s premier sport these past few years would Andy have won three times?

    #68480
    Profile photo of taffy
    Taffy
    Participant

    Jess really? I love Jess but her 2015 performance didn’t really stand out.

    I agree Mo should have won but the athletics vote was split between Him , Jess and Greg.

    Yes , I think Murray would still have won in 2015 had the Davis cup been shown on another channel. The fact is it would have been shown as millions like to watch it. You cant get tickets for the GB games, how many athletics events can you say the same for? London 2017 was not a sell out . it was a great success but not a sell out.

    I know many people who follow tennis all year round. They do not just tune in to Wimbeldon. I know far less athletics enthusiasts. The BASCS is like an extras club for thew cast of waiting for god. Tennis transcends all age groups.

    Sadly, you were right in an earlier post that many will only miss the great contribution of Mo after he has gone.

    without him we would have had 4 relay medals. Appauling in my view.

    #68481
    Profile photo of taffy
    Taffy
    Participant

    I have just looked at the voting stats for 2015 and 2016, have you seen how far back Mo was ? for whatever reason he clearly isn’t popular with the public. I do find that a bit odd as on social media everyone raves about how exciting his races are/were.

    #68497
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    Jess really? I love Jess but her 2015 performance didn’t really stand out.

    I agree Mo should have won but the athletics vote was split between Him , Jess and Greg.

    Yes , I think Murray would still have won in 2015 had the Davis cup been shown on another channel. The fact is it would have been shown as millions like to watch it. You cant get tickets for the GB games, how many athletics events can you say the same for? London 2017 was not a sell out . it was a great success but not a sell out.

    I know many people who follow tennis all year round. They do not just tune in to Wimbeldon. I know far less athletics enthusiasts. The BASCS is like an extras club for thew cast of waiting for god. Tennis transcends all age groups.

    Sadly, you were right in an earlier post that many will only miss the great contribution of Mo after he has gone.

    without him we would have had 4 relay medals. Appauling in my view.

    You question the obvious claims of Ennis-Hill in 2015?

    She comes back from childbirth and wins a world title, thats not worthy?

    Not sure how you evaluate exceptional sporting achievements Taffy, but in my opinion what Jess did was truly remarkable. The demands of the heptathlon test fitness, flexibility, strength and power like no other female event. Hardly the event to return to successfully after going through childbirth. Yet she achieved it.

    #68498
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    …..I also note you have not commented on the claims of Adam Peaty.

    #68508
    Profile photo of laps
    Laps
    Participant

    If tennis wasn’t the BBC’s premier sport these past few years would Andy have won three times?

    Yes.
    Steve you seem to have a bee in your bonnet about this BBC thing which in my opinion just isn’t that relevant. If you are a sports fan watching live sport on TV you will be mainly watching Sky, Eurosport, BT and others including dedicated channels. Eurosport has many many times more tennis than BBC. Currently two channels showing the US Open almost continually.

    #68509
    Profile photo of laps
    Laps
    Participant

    I have just looked at the voting stats for 2015 and 2016, have you seen how far back Mo was ? for whatever reason he clearly isn’t popular with the public. I do find that a bit odd as on social media everyone raves about how exciting his races are/were.

    From 2011 Mo has been 3rd (29,780 votes), 4th (131,327), 4th (51,945), – ,7th (31,311) and 4th again (54,476) last year. This is not the record of an unpopular sportsman. He just hasn’t been as popular a voting choice as a handful of others. 200,000 votes will probably be enough this year. He just needs a good push.

    If you were at the stadium in 2012 and again in 2017 you would be in no doubt at all that Mo has massive public support. About the noisiest sustained crowd support I have ever witnessed. But all he could do is win the 5000m and 10000m again which, to put it bluntly, do not measure up to the great prizes of sport.

    Actually Mo’s SPOTY record isn’t that different from Jess’s – 2009 3rd, 2010 3rd, 2012 2nd, 2015 3rd. She didn’t win it either but I don’t hear anyone suggesting reasons for her unpopularity. There is no need to, there is a golden era of British sport going on, with a double Wimbledon champion, one of the F1 greats, World Heavyweight champions, 4 of the last 5 Tour De France winners, masses of Olympic gold medals……

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by Profile photo of laps laps.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by Profile photo of laps laps.
    #68513
    Profile photo of laps
    Laps
    Participant

    Am I the only one here not getting the relevance of the Davis cup?

    In terms of sporting achievements I wouldn’t rank it anywhere near a Tour de France win, a Wimbledon win, winning gold in an olympic track event, winning the world cup etc.

    Don’t think 2015 was a defining moment for Murray at all compared to his other two SPOTY wins.

    Some of the doubts about the Davis Cup are fair comment in my opinion. But there are a number of factors which have to be chucked into the equation.
    (a) GB hadn’t won the Davis Cup for 79 years. Each year which went by getting knocked out or consigned to a lowly group was another humiliation. British tennis had had it up to the neck.
    (b) Like the Ryder Cup, the Davis Cup arouses extra public interest and emotions.
    (c) Murray has turned out for GB when most stars would have been resting injuries and making their excuses. To some extent he is paying the price now. I think the public admire his commitment on top of the fact that he virtually won it single-handed, with help from his brother.

    #68519
    Profile photo of stevek26
    SteveK26
    Participant

    Laps

    I’ve always admired BBC Sport, but over the last few years they have lost the rights for a number of events that historically they have covered very well, (e.g. golf, cricket etc), but kept tennis as their ‘jewel’.

    I can’t help feeling there is a link between Murray’s multiple SPOTY wins and the BBC’s love of tennis. I may be wrong.

    I actually quite like Andy.

    #68527
    Profile photo of philipo
    philipo
    Participant

    Its all about the views of the British public with their vast knowledge of sport!!!!

    #68528
    Profile photo of mrme
    MrMe
    Participant

    Some of the doubts about the Davis Cup are fair comment in my opinion. But there are a number of factors which have to be chucked into the equation.

    I see Wimbledon as the pinnacle for UK Tennis players. I think that is the one Andy Murray dreamed about winning since he was a child. Not the David cup.

    The 2015 Davis cup win didn’t define him as a player. He had won SPOTY before, 2015 was a good year for someone else to get recognition. But it seems Tennis trumps all, whatever the tournament.

    #68545
    Profile photo of taffy
    Taffy
    Participant

    Steve, I think Jess great had a great comeback, did she deserve to win SPOTY IMO no. You yourself would have selected Mo over her.

    Remember, it is Sports personality so it is not just about the sporting achievement.

    A few points rte Jess’s win. It was a good but not a great performance. A few of you need to look back at the 2015 thread as many of you were suggesting KJT threw away the gold. If that was the case was Jess’s performance really that superb? personally I think Jess would have still narrowly have beaten KJT.

    For me , MO should have won but he didn’t. Remember he was up against two other athletes so the vote is split. Also he was up against a rugby league player. As they rarely make the final selection, their fans will vote and clearly did.

    Murray has a huge following. If you put 2015 in to context it also followed a very close Scottish independence vote.

    Laps, Jess came second in 2012 partly because her vote was diluted by the sheer number of golds we won in other events. Also she was beaten by a British legend in Wiggins. His fellow cyclist finished 4th with way more votes than Mo polled in 2015.

    Steve, as for Peaty, in 2015 he was relatively unknown, he came on to the scene in 2014. In 2015 he won the worlds but only got silver at the Euros. To the public he was a relative unknown.

    I remember you predicting he would win spoty in 2016. Alas he didnt.

    I dont think he will win this year either but IMO he is deserving . His performances in and out of the pool have been superb. I love how he sings the anthem. His leg in both the relays was outstanding.

    Sadly it may well be Hamilton again. I hope it is Froome

    #68577
    Profile photo of fchd
    FCHD
    Participant

    One factor in Murray winning in 2015 was that the Davis Cup final was only a few days before the award was voted for, I believe the BBC added Murray and Tyson Fury as last-minute additions to the previously compiled (but not announced) shortlist.

    #68766
    Profile photo of ursus
    Ursus
    Participant

    So Froome it should be.

    Cycling’s a curious mix of the individual and the team and Sky have been quite outstanding in delivering two grand tours for Froome. I may be in the minority, again, here but as well as nicking all their sport, and doing it better, wouldn’t it be quite amusing to see the Beeb hand over Team of the Year to Team Sky?

    #68784
    Profile photo of mrme
    MrMe
    Participant

    I feel quite sorry for Froome. When Wiggins won the TDF he was awarded with the most competitive SPOTY title ever. Froome doesn’t get anywhere near that recognition.

    #68785
    Profile photo of ursus
    Ursus
    Participant

    Of course the irony is that Froome would almost certainly have won that 2012 tour if he hadn’t been forced to ride for Wiggins, a role which may have also cost him a Vuelta. Wiggins range of achievements – track to grand tour – is amazing, but Froome is a class apart on the roads.

    One day Froome will be superseded by someone with stronger legs. But between the ears the guy’s as hard as nails, with a real winner’s mentality. He doesn’t court the media, do plucky loser or cry in public, so will probably never win SPOTY.

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